Page 8 of 11
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Wed Oct 14, 2015 10:47 pm
by diogenesagogo
Just listened to some of her old stuff, up to White Chalk.
I think she's lost more than she's gained. Her emotional & vocal range have been sacrificed for .... what? I'm not quite sure.
Particularly on LES, her voice (for me) sounded too detached, too far removed. I think she said this was deliberate. Well, one of the main things I loved about Polly was her complete, visceral engagement with her songs; even on her gentle stuff, This Is Mine & Beautiful Feeling spring to mind, she was totally engaged. I believed every part of every note she sang.
I may be prejudging - I've only heard the snippets here - but I suspect she's fallen off the edge. I really, really hope I'm wrong.
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Wed Oct 14, 2015 11:31 pm
by Kuk91
If you don't think that she's giving her usual 150% of engagement on songs like "All and Everyone" or "In the Dark Places" - that's simply beyond my grasp. I also don't agree with the woman herself when she calls her "LES" voice "characterless" - the lyrics are full of very strong emotions, which are suppressed (in a way) by the fantastic clarity of her vocals, but that makes these emotions even stronger IMO.
"Death is NOW, and NOW, and NOW" - I have goosebumps every single time I hear some of the stronger "LES" material (and I listen to it almost every day for over a year now). And I do have A LOT of goosebumps when I listen to these recordings of the new songs. )))
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Wed Oct 14, 2015 11:38 pm
by Kujjj
diogenesagogo wrote:Just listened to some of her old stuff, up to White Chalk.
I think she's lost more than she's gained. Her emotional & vocal range have been sacrificed for .... what? I'm not quite sure.
Particularly on LES, her voice (for me) sounded too detached, too far removed. I think she said this was deliberate. Well, one of the main things I loved about Polly was her complete, visceral engagement with her songs; even on her gentle stuff, This Is Mine & Beautiful Feeling spring to mind, she was totally engaged. I believed every part of every note she sang.
I may be prejudging - I've only heard the snippets here - but I suspect she's fallen off the edge. I really, really hope I'm wrong.
diogenesagogo wrote:
I agree about white chalk and les, her voice seemed to be losing some strength and expression which really to me was the main fault with the last two albums. However, I think the lowest point was 2007. Her voice has been gaining its piwer and expression back, there were some videos of her singing cmon billy earlier this year and her voice was great as ever. To the contrary, I think she's on an uphill swing right now. I mean, her voice was noticeably better on les, on battleship hill, color of the earth, all and everyone, nightingale she sounds very good. I definiteiy think shes on another peak right now. The entire 90s up to stories were a peak for her. She faltered a bit with uh huh her. White chalk was an improvement and a new direction, and les was up there with her best. I suspect this album will rank with her best too.
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:32 am
by protocols
I don't agree with this narrative I see everywhere that Uh Huh Her was a misstep. It is the most honest album she has made aside from 4-Track Demos.
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 5:34 am
by Kuk91
protocols wrote:I don't agree with this narrative I see everywhere that Uh Huh Her was a misstep. It is the most honest album she has made aside from 4-Track Demos.
I love "Uh Huh Her" very much as well (since the first listen, really). I do hope that someday Polly will release another compilation of her demos. And I don't agree about the "White Chalk" era - if live versions of "Grow Grow Grow" or, for example, "Send His Love To Me" are not define as powerful vocal numbers, then I don't know what is.
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 5:42 am
by Kujjj
Though I'm not sure what honest means in this context, perhaps stripped down?, I know every body has a different favorite Polly album. Some people favor her earliest albums, some favor TBYML, some Is this Desire, some Stories, and I know a lot of people who's favorite is LES. For me, my favorite is a draw between TBYML and Stories, then it's be a tie between ITD, Rid Of me, Les then a tie between Dry and WC, and then Uh Huh Her, which is the only album I don't rate highly. I really honestly like 2 or 3 tracks from it. And a few more I like when they are performed live, but not the album version- Shame for example.
For me, I just find a lot of the album bland. I know a lot of her fans don't rate Stories too highly though, and its my favorite tied with TBYML.
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 5:47 am
by Kujjj
Kuk91 wrote:protocols wrote:I don't agree with this narrative I see everywhere that Uh Huh Her was a misstep. It is the most honest album she has made aside from 4-Track Demos.
I love "Uh Huh Her" very much as well (since the first listen, really). I do hope that someday Polly will release another compilation of her demos. And I don't agree about the "White Chalk" era - if live versions of "Grow Grow Grow" or, for example, "Send His Love To Me" are not define as powerful vocal numbers, then I don't know what is.
I think her voice could be hit or miss during White Chalk, I do remember a great performance of Grow Grow Grow, but I also remember an iffy performance of The Devil. Also, one of the few performances of The Dancer was in 2008 and it was amazing. Of course, a bad year for PJ Harvey is like the best year for most singers.
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 6:03 am
by DrDark
IMO the problem with White Chalk was that many of the songs had her singing above her natural alto range. As I recall, there were a number of cringe-worthy off key moments on more than a few White Chalk live performances.
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 6:21 am
by Kujjj
DrDark wrote:IMO the problem with White Chalk was that many of the songs had her singing above her natural alto range. As I recall, there were a number of cringe-worthy off key moments on more than a few White Chalk live performances.
Yes, which is a risky thing to do live. Sometimes it works, and you hit the notes. But when you're working at the top of your range, it can be unreliable. And of course, since she just started singing in that register at the time of White Chalk she didn't have a lot of experience singing like that. By LES, she sang better in a higher range- On BattleShip Hill and Hanging in The wire.
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:53 pm
by Kuk91
http://www.thelineofbestfit.com/feature ... -in-london
Precise tracklist from the second night:
Kosovo
Poem – On a Dirt Road
Poem – The Abandoned Village
Song – Chain of Keys
Poem – Dance on the Mountain
Poem – Where it Begins
Song – The Wheel
Afghanistan
Song – The Orange Monkey
Poem – The Guest Room
Poem – Adhan
Poem – The Hand
Song – The Ministry of Social Affairs
Poem – An Initiation
Poem – The Boy
Poem – Charikar
Poem – The Glass
Song – Dollar, Dollar
Poem – Poem
Poem – Dead Tanks
Poem – The First Shot
Poem – Begging Bowl
Poem – Talking to Dog
Poem – At the Airbase
Washington, D.C
Song – The Community of Hope
Poem – To the Oldest Homo Sapiens
Song – Homo Sappy Blues
Poem – On the Corner of 1st and D
Poem – 3am Washington, DC
Song – Medicinals
Song – Near the Memorials to Vietnam and Lincoln
Poem – Two Cemeteries
Poem – Anacostia
Song – River Anacostia
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 11:34 pm
by DrDark
While not strictly "gigs", it would probably be a good idea to revise the gigography to include these two appearances: 2015-10-09 & 2015-10-10.
http://pjharveyshows.thegardenforum.org/
Hell..?
An argument could be made for also including any singing appearances she's made since 2012-01-21, but I haven't been keeping track.
Here's another review:
http://www.gigwise.com/reviews/103254/p ... all-london
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 6:50 am
by Kuk91
DrDark wrote:An argument could be made for also including any singing appearances she's made since 2012-01-21, but I haven't been keeping track.
I think there's only been two of them: "2013-06-09 - Borris House Festival of Writing and Ideas: Interview and "The Desperate Kingdom of Love"" and "2015-04-08 - Launch of Sue Webster's "The Folly Acres Cook Book", New York: "Dress", "C'mon Billy" and "April" (don't know the exact order of the songs)". And there's also been a "playing appearance": "2014-10-18 - Ann Demeulemeester's book event, London: "Wing" (with Patti Smith)".
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 3:46 pm
by Hell and High Water
I'm on the road and away from my desk, perhaps if you could PM me shows to include in the gigography, I would have them all in one place when I get back. Thanks!
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2015 6:53 pm
by soulfadelic
diogenesagogo wrote:Just listened to some of her old stuff, up to White Chalk.
I think she's lost more than she's gained. Her emotional & vocal range have been sacrificed for .... what? I'm not quite sure.
Particularly on LES, her voice (for me) sounded too detached, too far removed. I think she said this was deliberate. Well, one of the main things I loved about Polly was her complete, visceral engagement with her songs; even on her gentle stuff, This Is Mine & Beautiful Feeling spring to mind, she was totally engaged. I believed every part of every note she sang.
I may be prejudging - I've only heard the snippets here - but I suspect she's fallen off the edge. I really, really hope I'm wrong.
I think conceptually speaking she might be entering her Dylan-esque retreat, but with respect to her voice: what makes you think that those earlier performances were any less deliberate? 'Emotion' or 'rawness' is still very much a concerted artistic choice, despite its dogged reputation in rock music as something natural or real or whatever.
Also, Polly's nearly 50. The physical mechanics of singing change as you age, and I'd say that her style of singing might be different so that she can guarantee the strength of her voice for years to come.
Re: "The Hollow of the Hand" shows (ALL about both nights)
Posted: Sat Oct 17, 2015 10:20 pm
by diogenesagogo
Just listened to more Polly. perhaps one of the factors is that she used her mid-range predominantly in her older stuff, restricting falsetto to accent emotion (e.g. Taut) or astonishing low range for weirdness (e.g I Think I'm A Mother). Because of her incredible tonal (& dynamic) range there is a tremendous harmonic richness to her voice which she can modulate at will to produce the desired effect (although it's probably a mostly unconscious process).
She can present a whole range of emotions in a single note (at least, she does for me).
I've never heard anyone who can so fully realise the experience of being human; neither the best classical singers, nor the most proficient 'pop' singers can do this for me.
Her later stuff seems to eschew this. That, I think. is the problem for me. She is stretching too far, to take on the experiences of whole countries, whole nations of people, & trying to do it in a rather dry, detached way.
In fact, I've just realised her delivery seems to be harking back to her voice at the very beginning (Heaven).
I've tried, but that's how it strikes me, & it doesn't work. That's all I can say really.