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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 8:55 pm 
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i dont't think she is bothered by her schedule and in my opinon that's her managment's fault, i don't belive she is spending any time in organizing her schedule. but i do agree there is no justice whit lack of her apperances in those parts of the world. as i already sad, she has never been in croatia in 20 years, neither in serbia, bosnia or slovenia ( as i know). and i know there would be plenty of people that wold pay as many as her menagment want just to see her. she could indeed change her route for a moment.


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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 10:28 pm 
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All your facts are correct, but you've overlooked one. She has said that she doesn't particularly like the grind of touring. I can't bring up a quote at the moment, but I believe she said it more than once. She's also 43 now and probably isn't interested in more money or another grueling tour to build album support.

It is disappointing. I count myself as damn lucky that she came to SF last year (one of only 3 places in the US).

My theory is she burned out on the 2004 tour. Remember the flap about her saying at the last 2004 gig "this is the last show I will ever play". If you look at the 2004 tour schedule you can see it was pretty intense:
http://pjharveyshows.thegardenforum.org/2003-2005.html

One can argue that she made the 2006 "Please Leave Quietly" DVD as kind of a bookend for that part of her life.

I agree with your statement "the desires of the people who support her career financially are less important it seems". She's never taken an active role in any of her online sites and yes her b-sides continue to languish. You are correct, this is in stark contrast to most other artists these days.

Her relationship with her fan base can only be described as 'at-arms-length'. This isn't new. Blandford goes into some detail regarding this. It appears there were a few stalking incidents early in her career that to some degree traumatized her. Blandford also relates how an early fan mail newsletter was shut down because of too many genuinely strange letters coming in.

Correction: her relationship with her fans can only be described as "non-existent". Witness the silence during LES concerts (granted that may have been intentional for artistic effect), in spite of repeated entreaties to "talk to us" by the crowd. Let's face it, she's a shy person and she has to force herself to do interviews and stage banter is only there if she's forced into doing it during solo shows. That's just the way it is.

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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 10:30 pm 
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None of this should be surprising. She has the same manager as U2.

I agree about that '04 tour. I think that was her last hurrah in terms of the rockstar fast life (at least in PJ Harvey terms).


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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 11:40 pm 
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I wonder if Island has any say on how much she can tour and where. I know she has creative freedom and control of her output, regardless of what Island may say/want to change because face it, music is about quantity, not quality these days. But she may not have control of where she can play if that's the case, as I'm not sure if all record labels pay for tours in the long run.

soulfadelic wrote:
None of this should be surprising. She has the same manager as U2.


Can you elaborate? I don't follow U2.

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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:06 am 
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..... U2 = huge stadiums = profits

I've read in at least a couple of places that tours are what pay the bills these days. Albums, CDs, iTunes: it's lucky to break even,

Back to Polly. I have no doubt that her absolute desire is to make the best possible art, but it's not really for us, it's for her. She's said over and over again that she's happy we can listen to it and gain something from it, but we're pretty secondary in the process. There'll be no discussion of lyrics or anything close to her personal life. She's chosen to be an enigma. There's nothing wrong with that, but it's a little hard to understand when you see other artists, like for example St Vincent:
http://www.ilovestvincent.com/index.php/blog
(can you imagine PJ writing a blog or tweeting, lol)

This makes sense when you consider one of Polly's biggest role models, Don Van Vliet. An eccentric recluse if ever there was one. We're lucky Polly's still in the music business (but of course after last year's success there's little chance she'll hang it up for a career as a painter etc.).

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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:51 am 
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The guy who runs her management company, Paul McGuinness, is a supreme douchebag. I won't bother posting the links, but his screed back in 2010 against file-sharing and his de facto support for a corrupt corporate music industry resorting to legal battles to try and prop up their failed business models demonstrate how out of touch he really is. He's a hack, and U2 are just vile. If Polly was really unconcerned with money she would distance herself from those sorts of people and arrange tours at venues not aligned with corporate entities like Live Nation. But she's never been that sort of artist and she probably has a cushy relationship with her management after 20 years.

I have to side-eye when I hear people claim that LES represents Polly's artistic politicization or something. Politics is practice. The fact that she acted so polite or even agreed to play in the presence of a warmongering conservative like David Cameron is suspect, especially given the subject matter of LES. I liked the record just fine, but frankly I'm more interested in cultural production from conflict zones themselves. Privileged outsiders giving lip service in the form of vague protest songs rarely appeals to me.

I wonder how much cash P's got in the bank. Was Stories really a million seller?


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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 11:21 am 
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DrDark wrote:
..... U2 = huge stadiums = profits

I've read in at least a couple of places that tours are what pay the bills these days. Albums, CDs, iTunes: it's lucky to break even,

Don't forget U2 = huge ego too :wink:
There's been a complete proliferation of concerts/festivals in UK/Europe certainly to back up what you read. I go to 10x more shows than I did 20 years ago.

I was hoping Polly might at least do 1 festival this year perhaps, like 2010.

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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2012 4:28 am 
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soulfadelic wrote:
The guy who runs her management company, Paul McGuinness, is a supreme douchebag. I won't bother posting the links, but his screed back in 2010 against file-sharing and his de facto support for a corrupt corporate music industry resorting to legal battles to try and prop up their failed business models demonstrate how out of touch he really is. He's a hack, and U2 are just vile. If Polly was really unconcerned with money she would distance herself from those sorts of people and arrange tours at venues not aligned with corporate entities like Live Nation. But she's never been that sort of artist and she probably has a cushy relationship with her management after 20 years.

U2 are certainly not vile. They've written and recorded some songs which rank amongst the greatest in rock history. They were exceedingly popular in the '80s, and 90s and have been a superb live act for most of the time. They also must have at least helped Polly's career when she toured with them years ago.

As for alleging Polly's only concerned about money that's just absurd. The very nature of what she does, ie writes and records unconventional songs which are hardly chart fodder proves that commercial ambition has never been her no. 1 goal.


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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2012 1:39 am 
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Lots of crap was popular in the 80s. I'm afraid I don't have the patience or interest in deconstructing Bono & co. for the U2 evangelists. I think they're shite and we'll leave it at that, although I would have loved to be a fly on the wall during those Eno-Lanois-Flood-Lillywhite sessions from Joshua Tree and Achtung Baby. There are certain production environments that I can appreciate on some of their records, but I find their songs, their band persona, their live schtick exceedingly dull. (I remember liking "The Unforgettable Fire" when I was a youngin'. Then I grew up.)

I didn't say Polly was concerned only with money, I was asserting that if money was truly the least of her concerns she wouldn't be cozying up to corporate managerial hacks. But she's a career artist at this point and a veteran, so I wouldn't expect her to suddenly go the DIY route.


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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2012 7:37 pm 
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feroshispete wrote:
I love PJ's music BUT there are some serious flaws to the genius. As time goes by it becomes more and more apparent that there's something not quite right with either her or her management or some combination of the two. Although i think she's incredibly talented and i love her music, its my belief that doesn't mean she [or any other artist or celebrity] is not open for criticism.

A few facts....

PJ Harvey's concert appearance schedule continues to be at Big Name, Big Corporate, Big Money festivals in the USA and Europe only. Year after year, after year, after year.

One could easily garner from these "observations" that it appears that fiscal reward and critical recognition is the only deciding factor in where PJ Harvey [or her management] chooses to appear in concert and that the desires of the people who support her career financially are less important it seems.

She's no different to any other 'name' artists who habitually tour the big European and US festivals. At the end of the day no one is in it to tour and lose money because of a (perceived) lack of regnition or interest in a particular country, despite a few enthusiastic fans existing out there.

In any case be grateful PJ tours at all, because in the case of one popular artist like Kate Bush, who still today has many ardent and loyal fans, there's an example of somebody who never tours or performs live, and has always stayed well aloof from her fans - far more so than PJ.

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I am losing faith with her personally but not artistically! Which i could translate as I'm more likely to download her material in the future [illegally] rather than supporting her financially anymore.

I agree that if you are not happy about an artist's attitude, don't throw your hard-earned bucks at them. But I think you are being a bit harsh with PJ. Unlike many others she's played festivals or done live gigs when she hasn't had new material to promote. It seems that in the past she genuinely enjoyed playing live and has said so in interviews. Perhaps with middle-age years advancing she's finding touring more of a chore now.


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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 9:07 pm 
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feroshispete wrote:
I love PJ's music BUT there are some serious flaws to the genius. As time goes by it becomes more and more apparent that there's something not quite right with either her or her management or some combination of the two. Although i think she's incredibly talented and i love her music, its my belief that doesn't mean she [or any other artist or celebrity] is not open for criticism.

A few facts

1. How many times in a career spanning 20+ years has she appeared in concert in: a) Latin America? b) Asia? or even c) Eastern Europe? Is it that people in these areas don't deserve her [or the managements] attention?

2. We ourselves in Australia have been "graced" with her presence just 5 times in 22 years for a total of 35 shows and 2 of those tours were festival tours in 2001 and 2003. 21 of her shows have been in only Sydney and Melbourne and 18 [Half] of her shows in this country were associated with her 2 festival appearances in 2001 and 2003. Actually when you think about it we're one of the "lucky" ones.

3. Although it cant been proven as "fact" I'm quite sure she would sell out most of her shows right now in Romania or Mexico or Poland or Tokyo or Argentina or S.Korea or heck, when has she appeared in Canada? Why do these seem less attractive places to give a show? Maybe because the profit margin is unattractive? Perhaps because people in Bucharest or Sofia or Sao Paulo or Vancouver simply will/can not fork out 50-70 quid a ticket. Maybe you could fill a stadium in these countries but it would still only make half the money a western european appearance would make?

4. PJ Harvey's concert appearance schedule continues to be at Big Name, Big Corporate, Big Money festivals in the USA and Europe only. Year after year, after year, after year.

5. Whilst the majority of artists these days offer all kinds of b-sides, bonus tracks, live tracks etc, etc, as rewards or incentives to purchase their material, PJ Harvey seems to be going in reverse and is making her non-LP material less available. Its not that she has a lack of it, its just she [or her management] cant be bothered offering it to us.

One could easily garner from these "observations" that it appears that fiscal reward and critical recognition is the only deciding factor in where PJ Harvey [or her management] chooses to appear in concert and that the desires of the people who support her career financially are less important it seems.


Many of you will disagree vehemently with my comments but i ask you consider them logically for just a moment before flaming me with undeserved vigour.


I am losing faith with her personally but not artistically! Which i could translate as I'm more likely to download her material in the future [illegally] rather than supporting her financially anymore.


I think the same. I never saw her live, but I couldn´t buy their records. Although she didn´t really care very little about this. Wait a concert of her for over a decade, etc ...
We have to travel to U.S. or Europe. I have no hope for her to return here.


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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 2:12 am 
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That is what frustrates me about the way Polly tours or chooses to tour. She clearly has a worldwide audience. She sells out almost every show she does put out there. Why not tour more?
As Dr.Dark noted, she hates touring, but you know what? We all have aspects of our jobs that we hate, but we do them anyway. Ok, granted, it's a crappy comparison but still.
If she legit hates it, then she shouldn't tour at all. It's a bit of a slap to the face to fans. Playing 2 to 3 cities in a big ass place like America is ridiculous. Down right neglecting the rest of the world save for Europe is not reasonable either. This is why I have a feeling Island has a say in it, somehow. There's got to be more to it.

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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 11:25 am 
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OK ive been OS so i know the reply is pretty old [china actually so try the web from this joint]

i agree with Dr Dark comments, Polly has never shown any interest in us! I am quite lucky actually having several opportunities to see her in the last decade [2001, 2003, 2004, 2007 and 2011].......................BUT from a privileged perspective i just shake my head!

polly makes her living off of us yes? but has little concern for those of us who have a currency that cant turn her a profit?

it seems harsh, but it appears true? i mean, can you sing a different song?

anyone who ignores the Latin American market is not only ignorant and well, a bit frickin bigoted, but incredibly stupid as well, so blame her marketing BUT

how much can we blame her industry people really?........does she have no interest in PR as some would attest, or absolutely no interest in the hand that feeds her?


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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 11:57 am 
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Whilst I understand the frustration for fans who haven't had the chance to see Polly live, some of this thread seems a mite over-critical.

Some artists tour a great deal; some don't.
- I saw Bob Dylan about 15 years ago, and he has pretty much been touring ever since! Hundreds of gigs, no doubt reaching hundreds of thousands of people.
- I was lucky enough to see Tom Waits in 2004 - his only UK gig, and the first time he'd played in the UK for 17 years! His next 'UK leg of a tour' was one gig in Edinburgh! His performance rate is far lower than Polly.
- And some of us remember not bothering trying to get tickets for Kate Bush's 'first' tour in 1979, not realising she would never tour again or play live (apart from a few contributions to other shows, e.g. for Amnesty)

Polly has toured a great deal compared to some - okay, so not reaching every part of the world, but over the years she has played many many gigs. She doesn't owe us live performances - no artist does. Some artists don't like to tour - must be lots of reasons: cost of shows, impact on personal life, perhaps not enjoying performing live, not enjoying the pressure of performing.

Touring is not a profitable business for many acts. Yes, some people stand to make millions from tours, particularly some big stadium bands, but even then, don't assume they are just raking it in. I've been lucky enough to see Polly five times now - four London shows and one New York one - and I don't see how she could have been making many thousands out of each of those shows.


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 Post subject: Re: LES tour over?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2012 12:13 pm 
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feroshispete wrote:
PJ Harvey's concert appearance schedule continues to be at Big Name, Big Corporate, Big Money festivals in the USA and Europe only. Year after year, after year, after year.


In response to this particular comment, I was reflecting on the performances I've seen - I don't think any could be classed as Big name, big corporate, big money: Somerset House, Festival Hall, Troxy and Royal Albert Hall in London, and the Beacon Theatre New York (whilst part of the New Yorker festival that year, it was a 400 ticket event from what I remember - not 'big').

The festival circuit must have some real positives for performers: they are not responsible for so much of the trappings of performance there - staging, PR, ticketing, security, lighting, sound, etc etc - and can be seen by relatively large numbers of people. It also had reflected, in some ways, the way in which people wanted to hear their music - lots of artists in a short space of time. Not for everyone I know (I've done festivals in my time, but now the downsides outweigh the positives - at least until some dream festival list appears that is truly unmissable!)

Maybe the recent downturn in festivals (certainly in the UK we've seen a number of scheduled festivals get cancelled this year due to poor ticket sales) will mean artists return to more personalised tours - certainly some bands who had been planning a one-off festival slot here have since set up individual gigs.

So, feroshispete, I get your frustration at Polly's approach to touring, but I don't think you can lump her into the Big name, big corporate, big money category just yet.


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